Recorded on July 6, 2017, this is an amazing conversation between Bill Ryan from Project Avalon and Richard Dolan, one of the most respected and arguably important voices in Ufology. For a long time, Richard has said almost nothing about the widespread problems concerning 'whistleblower' credibility. He speaks out at last and while he is careful and respectful as always, he does NOT mince his words. To put it simply: Richard makes new, clear, on-record statements, and breaks new ground. Anyone who cares about the current serious problems in the Ufology research community has to hear this out, in full... right to the very end. The problems, as many reading this will know, have been caused by various degrees of irresponsibility and/or very sloppy vetting (in some cases, no vetting whatsoever), and the over-eagerness of some individuals and organizations to offer celebrity platforms for claimed 'witnesses' who, Richard Dolan and Bill Ryan both argue cogently, have almost no credibility whatsoever. Contrary to the inevitable claims of some, this is not an 'attack'. This is a DEFENSE of the field, a commitment — and a call to others — to retain respectability and high standards of evidence and research. This is ALL about standards. And some people and organizations out there may not care an iota about research standards; their agenda seems to be sensationalism, popularity, money, commercialism, and a disturbingly populist, cult-like 'New Age' message that belongs NOWHERE in this serious field of research.